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 Post subject: Re: Low expectations
PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 6:08 pm 
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Oscar_Actuary wrote:

In other words, at 270lbs, 6' 3" and maybe a 150 lb bench 5RM, would you work to get stronger or leaner ?



I won't say you are that out of shape to begin with. If you are anywhere near 20%, all you are is some shrugs & lateral raises away from looking like a brick $h1t house in a shirt. lol

But seriously. You've been "fat" for awhile right? So then who cares. Just get stronger and worry abotu shredding fat later.

Takes years to build grainy dense muscle, 3-6 months to lose the fat. And the more muscle you have, the easier it is to lose the fat.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 6:13 pm 
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Yeah, I've been slim before, @ age 20: 32" waist, 180 lbs.
But I've never been strong. The prospect is exciting!

thanks for encouragement.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 6:15 pm 
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Oscar_Actuary wrote:
Yeah, I've been slim before, @ age 20: 32" waist, 180 lbs.
But I've never been strong. The prospect is exciting!

thanks for encouragement.


180 @ 6'3"?

So skinny lol.

(waits for pete to put me in a triangle ;) )


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 Post subject: Re: Low expectations
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:14 pm 
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nygmen wrote:
Oscar_Actuary wrote:

In other words, at 270lbs, 6' 3" and maybe a 150 lb bench 5RM, would you work to get stronger or leaner ?



I won't say you are that out of shape to begin with. If you are anywhere near 20%, all you are is some shrugs & lateral raises away from looking like a brick $h1t house in a shirt. lol

But seriously. You've been "fat" for awhile right? So then who cares. Just get stronger and worry abotu shredding fat later.

Takes years to build grainy dense muscle, 3-6 months to lose the fat. And the more muscle you have, the easier it is to lose the fat.


If you've been big for a while, I would lift like a freakin' maniac. Give yourself a solid year worth of starting strength into texas method, linear progression, where you don't worry about the fat. You'll look and feel like a totally different person.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:16 pm 
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What if I were 320 lbs.. is there range where we swing to "Lose fat buddy!"
Or what if I were "newly fat" (I presume the reference to being fat for a while is only because it presumes I don't mind being tubby for a while longer while we get that muscle up and strong, not some other reason ?)

thanks. I really appreciate all feedback.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:52 pm 
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Building strength, and therefore muscle, will help you lose weight. You should clean up your diet. Get rid of any junk food. Minimize the grains. Get lots of protein and good fats. Don't worry about calories. Eat when you're hungry and stop when you're full. I expect of the next 6 months your weight will normalize and you'll be leaner and stronger at the same time. After a few months, re-evaluate and adjust. You'll know then what you need to do.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:12 pm 
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thanks again!

That getting rid of all junk is the stickler. I'm trying to not "deny" but replace. It works to some degree but still have sweet tooth that and apple+peanut butter isn't always taking care of.

mmm pancakes! :red:


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:22 am 
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It's always the stickler. Some people find it easier to go cold turkey. Cut out all grains and sugars for at least 3-4 weeks. That includes fruit. That breaks the cycle of dependence. Then you can reintroduce them as you are able to tolerate them.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:49 pm 
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Quote:
Then you can reintroduce them as you are able to tolerate them.


Are you saying after going cold turkey long enough, my body will no longer crave, even dislike them? I found that is true with sugary drinks.

I did do 24 water fasting 2x a week for 8 weeks. So, absolutes are not out of the cards. I'll definitely keep this in mind. If nothing else it will force me to think of more creative alternatives.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:55 pm 
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Yes, after going without them, the cravings will go away. You still have to be vigilant, especially if your wife like to bake. Most diets have an indoctrination phase for this reason.


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 Post subject: Re: Low expectations
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 3:05 am 
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as an update, while I'm still weak for my size, I've mananged to increase my 3 X 5/6 working weights by
Squat: 77 lbs
Deadlift: 90 lbs
Bench: 45 lbs
OH Press: 35 lbs
BB Row: 40 lbs

Weight change: +6 lbs

I'll take that. Waist size is the same. Arms and chest and thighs are slightly bigger, or look more muscular.

Presses are plateuing but I'm sure I have more in me, unles my genetics are poop.

Big change in sleep.
This is rare tonight, as I spent several hours at work and got a late start on training.
For the last month I've been going to bed at 10:30-12:00 and waking 6.5 - 8 hours later. This after 20 yrs of going to bed between 2:00-4:00 am and getting less than 6 hours most nights during the week. I feel much better.

I now train in the early morning (today again was exception. It really helps my program adhension. I've moved IF, 16 off/ 8 on. Seeems sugar cravings are reduced. Wroknig hard to get plenty of protein but that is tough. Using whey and cassei to help. Canned salmon, tuna, chicken. And ther slow cooker for beef, tukey chili, etc. And count me among those who favorite breakfast includes eggs and spinach scramble cooked in VCO!

ok. Thanks for outlet and support!


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 Post subject: Re: Low expectations
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:06 am 
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good lad Oscar, keep at it.


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:34 am 
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Oscar_Actuary wrote:
thanks again!

That getting rid of all junk is the stickler. I'm trying to not "deny" but replace. It works to some degree but still have sweet tooth that and apple+peanut butter isn't always taking care of.

mmm pancakes! :red:


For what it's worth, I've always had a sweet tooth and still do. And no, my sweet tooth is not fooled by apple and peanut butter. it can tell the difference between that and peanut butter cups.

But on the bright side, when I started with the protein powder, 100g/day, and "eat real food" diet, I just don't have the appetite for a dozen cookies like I used to. I might grab one after dinner, might not. Changing my diet that way is the only thing that ever helped me avoid sweets w/o exerting will power or going cold turkey.

So that's just my experience, your mileage may vary.


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 Post subject: Re: Low expectations
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:47 pm 
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Yea good stuff oscar

As Robertscott said I think (having recently discovered/experience it :) ) that the rest intervals being trimmed back to 1min/1min 30 in my volume work (10x10 GVT) have cut my fat back. I knew I was getting more defined but didnt regularly measure my fat, I had it done today (all-be-it with one of those pretty innaccurate electical current things) and was really chuffed to see I had gone down from around 16 to 13.8% - it could be a number of things, but the way I feel after sessions and the ... intensity of shorter rest periods ... I'm fairly confident that is responsible.

That said, you should certainley ride out the starting strength gains first - it doesn't make sense to just skip around routines/methods just because it did something for someone at some point in their training life - it's just one to consider when your presses get stale and you want something new to throw in there. I will be going back to something like Texas method or 5/3/1 when I've done 8 weeks on the 10x10 stuff - my goal will always be multiples of bodyweight on the big compounds.

As for sugar - The fasting/banning of sugar is great yea, I often fall back into it, adding some here and there, eating crunchy nut cornflakes when being a stoner, drinking too much milk outside of workout days etc before I realise that I'm getting bad again - but a 4 day strict added sugar free/low carb days and I'm set again - back to snacking on dairy(...cheese, cream - less milk) and stuff like PB or roasted nuts and putting water in my shakes. Initially it could be 7-10 days where I'd need to deprive myself, but I think it's easier now, as I say, 4 days give or take 1 and back on track. Definately the case with fizzy drinks - I use that stuff like spirits now, a couple of swigs of coca-cola once in a rare while and it's such a sweet/strong thing that I cannot comprehend the days when I would drink a 2 litre bottle - the idea of that makes me wince/nauseous now.


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 Post subject: Re: Low expectations
PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 1:29 am 
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Good job, Oscar. This is a marathon, not a sprint; the strength gains you are making now will serve you well later when it is time to cut.

_________________
Our greatest fear should not be of failure, but of succeeding at things in life that don't really matter.--Francis Chan


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