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Peter's MMA & Weight Training log discussion

Posted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 8:24 am
by pdellorto
Folks, you can discuss my rehab journal
in this thread.



Posted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 10:22 am
by TimD
Pete, this is coming from an old geezer w/ osteoarthritus in the right hip, and aimed mainly at that point. Glad to see you are using it (your hip). What got me into trouble a few years back was to NOT use it. I have to watch the amount of weight I use in any squatting move, which is one reason I do a lot of the overhead stuff. Legs are really not the main factor.Also, every morning (and I don't consider this a "workout"), because of the stiffness and soreness, I do about ten minutes of stepping on one of those old stepper contraptions I got at a yard sale for 5 bucks, or on my rowing machine or both alternating every few minutes with some form of body weight squat/lunge/or 20lb bar overhead squat. I've found that just ten mins of this loosens things up dramatically, cuts the pain way down (along w/ Ibprofen). Also, combined with an antiflammatory type of diet it seems to work wonders. Antiinflammatoryis basically knocking out most starch, sugars, and using as little gluten as possible. Just a thought.

Your routine looks fine, BTW.

Posted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 6:51 pm
by pdellorto
I hear you on the hip, TimD. One of my friends got a gall bladder operation and ended up having to be more active after the surgery than before, doctor's orders. He encouraged me to be active ASAP and so did the surgeon. As soon as I could walk they took away my wheelchair and told me to tough it out. As as I could use stairs I started doing stair-climbing for exercise. I think that helped a lot.

My workout is going to vary a lot. I'm expanding my pool of "can do" exercises and trying to hit all of them, with a bit more emphasis on metcon to start. No stamina, I have to fix that. I'm also worried I'll overdo it if I push too hard on a heavy strength exercise and injury myself...or just learn and reinforce bad technique.

The thrusters were really instructive, though. 45kg isn't too heavy for thrusters for me, and if I can shoulder press it 5 times I should be easily able to blast out thrusters with it by the bunches. But I have no explosion right now...I can squat down but I can't come up with any speed. I'm glad I passed over the dumbbell swings/pullups workout I was considering...I'd never have managed swings.

But if anything occurs to you guys that would be a good workout, pass it along. I found that Javorek complex on AOL video. The demo guy looks starving and weak, but the workout looks fine. ... 2403761427

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 8:01 am
by pdellorto
4/16/08 workout notes:

- My right lat/spinal erector feels very tight, even DLs didn't loosen it up. Need to get it looked at.
- Using plates for the situps wasn't optimal, too much weight is too low on my body, but the DBs were murder. Plate-loading DBs keep trying to roll onto my face, which is dangerous at best. 5/20kg was no where near a real 5 rep max. Maybe next time I'll hold plates behind my head to push the resistance back further.
- 3 minute break in the situps was because the promoter/ref for my last fight came to talk to me.
- Got some mild butt burn from the situps. Aargh.
- 10 rounds of "Cindy" should take me less than 10 minutes...I've really slowed down, but it's a good benchmark for me. When I'm back down to 10 rounds in less than 10 minutes, or up to 20 rounds in 20, I'll know I've more than bounced back.

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 8:11 am
by corless319_
Yeah I decided to add the two together and see how it felt. The two being dls and deep squats. I did the dl's first and the squats were incredibly tough. The lunges killed me haha. I got to the point where I was so fatigued I felt exactly like someone mentioned one time weak tired my eyes were kinda closing by themselves lol but it was amazing. As I set here my glutes are twitching! haha your workout seems in depth. I used to have a lot of individual workouts separating the muscles but I've noticed that by doing compund lifts like the dl's I feel the strength gains. Sad thing yesterday my two workout partners bailes on me same as last week. LOL I know they had things to do buuuuuuut still feels that way. Hows the rehab doing? Hows your eye and hip holding up?

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:26 pm
by pdellorto
The eye is okay. Some pain under the eye (at the break/bone graft/plate insertion point). The hip is usually fine but it gets tired very quickly and then it hurts. Most pain is tearing off the bandages I have to keep on there. But my vision is fine, and my ROM on my hip is getting close to pre-op levels.

It's just that my conditioning sucks right now. I was less than my best before the operation, but I was close. It's slow to come back. My strength probably is down a bit, but it's hard to test with my hip still hurt. Can't strap on weights for a weighted chinup test, and I'm not foolish enough to go for a max DL or back squat when my hip is a weak point! :)

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 9:26 am
by TimD
Saw your entry about the weather. Yeah, it's breaking here in the Mid Atlantic as well. Low humidity, upper 70's, just all around nice. Time to take the dog's walking. It's my off day as well.
It's been a while (1996) since I've been in Japan, but I remember they had some interesting festivals that could really keep you occupied around this time of year. The feritilty thing and the cherry blossom thing come to mind. You been to any of them? That could be an interesting off day "active rest" trip. Ride a bike out there, get going with the locals, and have a ball.

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 7:27 pm
by pdellorto
Yeah, I went to a fertility festival just before my fight. There is a festival today but it's too far to bike (an hour by local train is too far to bike). I think I'm going to really relax today. I was dead tired yesterday after the bike ride and tired all night, slept like a log.


I'm also thinking about what kind of workouts to do this week. I'm planning on a barbell complex workout (probably this one: ... question01), possible Crossfit's "Isabel" (30 snatches, for time) or Ross Enamait's Magic 50 (if my hip will let me do swings, snatches, and burpees, that is), and another bodyweight squat/pullup/pushup workout of some kind. Maybe AMRAP or Tabata, not sure yet. And I'll fit in at least one max effort lift in there on day, I'm thinking probably front squats. The weather's getting nicer so I figure I'll fit in more bike rides too.

The week after I want to start on an actual lifting routine. I'm debating either doing a cycle of Starting Strength, or doing a slightly modified 3-day version of WS4SB3.

I figure Starting Strength's pros are - lots of squatting, and I'd like to get good at back squats, and simple, linear progression which is likely to help me get my strength back quickly. Cons are total lack of unilateral work, although if I modify the program I could do workout A (Monday), workout B (Wednesday or Thursday) and then a lighter unilateral workout (lunges and single-leg RDLs instead of squats, dumbbell bench presses instead of bench or shoulder presses, one-arm rows instead of power cleans).

WS4SB3 is an upper/lower split, although I'd modify it so it would be ME Upper, ME Lower, combo DE lower (jump training) + Rep Upper days. Pros are a good mix of bilateral and unilateral work and a good mix of rep ranges (which I responded well to), cons are upper/lower split and not as much heavy leg work. I did well on a two-day full body version of WS4SB but that was cut down significantly to account for 4-5 days a week of MMA training, so I think I'd do better with a 3-day workout.

Or I'll do something entirely of my own design, Push/Pull/Legs, with a mix of bilateral and unilateral works, mixing set/rep ranges into a Heavy/Light split. But I haven't really decided and I know I don't know enough yet about that kind of periodization to really design a solid one.

Still debating that, and trying to take my time. As soon as I decide I'll want to jump right into it and I really feel another week of metcon emphasis is a good idea.

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 8:45 pm
by TimD
I was over there in the spring of 96. when we pulled into port in Yokohama. The boss flew in for the refit period, and brought the office secretary in. The crew took her up to Tokyo for the fertility fest, and most of the people were dressed up in penis costumes, and saw Kathy, the gygene (sp?) and grabbed her and put her into the parade. It was a real trip.

For workouts, I'd recommend just doing some different complexes; the one you listed is great, I'm going to try it tomorrow, with an O bar and jump it up from there, ccording to how it treats me., as a warmup. I'm currently using Coach Rut's MEBB w/ follow-ons, but the one lift thing doesn't suit me. I'm using day 1 power sn and back squat, and Coach Rut;'s sq follow ons
Day 3 PC + 3 MP+ 2 PP +5 Fr Sq + coach rut's Pr follow ons
Day 5 Triplex pulls 3 flexed upringht rows,, clean grip, then a bit wider 3 scooped hi pulls, then 3 sn grip pulls off the floor, adding weight eah set, then a 3X5 BP plus Coah ruts DL add ons. Don't be afraid to innovate, but listen to what your body tells you.
On off days, i just do a kight complex or some BWT WODS.So far, I'm having no problems with it.
Best of luck, Pete

Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 10:09 pm
by pdellorto
Yeah, I went to a festival with a giant phallus - actually, a giant holy phallus, it's a Shinto shrine's centerpiece and therefore a god's physical residence. They haul it out with ropes and newly married women who want kids get to ride on it. Got to love the pre-Christian religions. And it's gaijin - short for gaikokujin (foreign country person).

The complex idea sounds good. So do your workouts, I'll cut-and-paste them into my workout idea file. I really need to learn to barbell snatch properly. I learned once from Rob Isza at Crossfit Morris County NJ but since then I've only done it sporadically with an empty bar. But I'm a little worried about getting too explosive too quickly. In some quick testing I've found I've got almost no explosive capacity right now - my vertical jump is down by a lot, I can do only a few box jumps before I start missing short, and my barbell thrusters stop hard at the bottom and crawl upwards. I figure it's got to be the hip surgery.

Instead of smacking my head against that brick wall I figure I'll do slower lifts for now and practice unweighted jumping and light snatches/dumbbell swings until I feel like I've got it back. I don't want to rush into weighted heavy power cleans, snatches, etc. until I've got my unweighted jumping/burpees/rope jumping chops back. No worry on busting stitches because they're out, but it'll be a while before the surgical cut really heals inside and before the piece of bone they took out grows back. It's not stiff anymore, but the ROM is slightly decreased and it gets tired suddenly and thoroughly. That's probably why my body refuses to explode like I want it too. Self-defense against my brain. :)

That 80-second complex on DeFranco's site looked nice. Not really unique but with that good video handy to reference it's easy to see how well it flows, and it's back-and-hips heavy which I need. I'll do it the same way - start at the 10kg bar, and add 5-10kg per set for a while and see where I end up.

Speaking of learning the snatch, I just watched this nice video of Dan John showing how to teach the squat, overhead squat, RDL, and so on. ... 1858251744
Goblet squatting and potato sack squatting have really helped me get my squat form down better.

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 1:42 am
by pdellorto
Man legs are screamingly sore today after the barbell complex and lots of back squats. Light squats and lots of rest during the complexes, but still, I'm very sore. Quads, hamstrings, calves...and my back is sore, too.

Today I'll just go on a long bike ride to an appointment (treatment for my tight right spinal errector/lat) but man, I know I'll be beat afterwards and need tomorrow off. For some reason it made me start wondering about doing 20-rep back squats as my heavy leg day. That would encourage me to keep the weight down which will help keep form correct, but still get me some good work. Something to think about for next week's routine.

Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:21 am
by pdellorto
Next week I start my workout. I've only got a limited set of days each week I can lift and I want my weekends free to travel. I can't wrestle at all yet, so that's killing a substantial portion of my strength/endurance training.

So I'm trying to decide between a 2-3 day a week WS4SB approach, or simply trying a 20-rep squat routine. Either way, I want to do lots of squats to practice the technique while I've got a squat rack handy and plenty of time to recover. The upside to the 20-rep squats is that I'll have to start relatively light so I'd be able to progress linearly for a while and get leg stamina.

If I do WS4SB I'd either do ME Upper, Rep Upper, ME Lower and stick some DE jumping on the ME Upper day, or do this one again. Not sure which.

If I do 20-rep squats I'd do either RDLs or SLDLs afterwards, then do a push/pull workout (vertical push/veritical pull one day, horizontal push/horizontal pull the next workout).

Haven't decided yet, probably won't really decide until Monday when I start. I overthink these things.

Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 6:57 am
by stuward

Everyone seems to be facinated with 20 Rep Squats.

The idea is using 10RM, you do 20 reps using breathing pauses as you start to fatique. They are brutally hard and create massive amounts of pain. They are also useless as a strength building exercise. Actually they may help in getting through a plateau, but that's ablout all.

If you are trying to gain strength, you need to progressively overload your muscles, balancing your recovery needs and training volume. 20 rep squats are completely outside this way of thinking.

Creating pain and a post workout pump may have a place in the mythology of body building but it does nothing to build strength and functionality.

Sorry for ranting in your journal but I see the "squats and milk" recommendation so much, people are starting to believe it and it's bull$h1t.


Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:26 am
by pdellorto
No problem Stuward. Rant away! I was thinking of doing them primarily as a way of ensuring I do lots of reps (for practice), keep the weight reasonable (I can't go overboard if I'm trying to hit 20 reps), and to build up my stamina. I'd expect some strength gain but primarily I'd expect to get endurance beyond what I'd get from just doing lots of bodyweight squats.

Plus a former competitive kickboxer/judoka I talked to used to do them as part of his fight prep, to get more leg stamina. His coach would have him do them in rounds to simulate the demands of a long kicking contest. The pump is pretty far from my aims!

I may save them for a later time, though.

Thanks for posting, though, and don't worry about ranting or whatever in my thread, the more feedback I get the better. Especially if I'm doing something stupid!

Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 8:46 am
by pdellorto
I've settled on my format for next week. I'm going to repeat the 2-day split for WS4SB I used before. Here is the outline, gotten from Joe DeFranco's "Ask Joe" column: ... question03

1. DE Lower Body Movement (Jump variation)
2. ME Upper Body movement
3. Posterior chain lower body movement
4. DB press variation
5. Lat/Upper back superset
6. Ab circuit (high reps)


1. ME Lower Body Movement
2. Rep Upper Body movement (chin-up or push-up variation)
3. Unilateral lower body movement
4. Shrug variation super-setted with rear delt movement
5. Grip training
6. Weighted abdominals
I'll post my choice of exercises and reps for the first 4-week cycle soon. I was planning on a 3-day version, but after kickboxing today for a mere 6 rounds, I realize I really want to spend as much time as I can doing more training. I love doing MMA training and I can't tell you how happy I was smashing right crosses into the bag today. Hit it so hard one of the guys told me he felt bad for the bag. So I'll go with 2 days of WS4SB, 2 days of cardio (places to go, and a bike to ride on), and 1-2 days of metcon - which may overlap the cardio days.