Out of curiousity, what would you class as 'improvement' ?Ironman wrote: So we have 4 possible answers to this. They are false, false, limited application or true because I missed something.
I think one of the main issues with this discussion is that I happen to think normal people should train more like real athletes. Where as, by the sounds of it, in your case , if "exercise X" doesn't lead to hypertrophy in "muscle Y", then improvement = Nil ??
If that's the case, which is fair enough, then if I were you, I wouldn't bother with any of it.
I'm not being critical there. It's like, my older brother is a bodybuilder type through and through. I told him i was learning the DB snatch. His first comment was, "what benefit does it give you? I can't think of any good that'll come out of it". Secretly, I think that's a stupid thing to say. However, how am I supposed to answer him? I can't tell him what muscles, if any, are going to have enhanced development from doing it. I could tell him its a 'full body exercise', that it makes you 'explosive' and that it 'really works your core'. But none of that would catch his interest. Incidentally, the one arm DB snatch is one o fMike Boyles favourite 'core' exercises.
I'm also coming from a perspective of previously having a really screwy posture. If i stop training my core (for stability), and stop stretching my hips, I go back into anterior tilt, for example. If I don't do much single leg stuff, and get too lazy to do my core stuff, I start to ache, and just generally feel crappy.
Another example, If I do a chop variation, and one side if much worse than the other, and over the next few weeks, I prioritise the weak side, and even them out. To me, that's good progress - i've found a weakness, and fixed it. To others, it would mean nothing. See what I mean ?
And this could be completely coincidental, but, my training partners been injured for the last 3-4 months. He's back now, but can't do certain movements yet (like squats and DL's). One thing he's never embraced from my training programs is the movement stuff i give him, the single leg stuff, and ''the core stuff'. One of his various issues it that his 'posterior core' is far stronger than his 'anterior core', and yes, he does front squats. When he does a standard Bar rollout, He falls on his face at rep 3-4 (i can elevate myself and do sets of 15 at the end of a session).
The fact that i'm still lifting the way I was 3 months ago and not having to alter things due to pain or injury, is progress, to me. People that aren't very injury prone will never understand that...
What i'm saying is, although we seem to largely agree on the main principles of training in general, I think we're both coming from a completely different perspective.